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Author Topic: General all round confusion  (Read 2151 times)

Murray Quinn

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General all round confusion
« on: April 25, 2009, 12:20:45 AM »

       I wonder if someone can shed some light on the following topics and/or questions.

       In “St. Columban Lot Registrations ca.1823-1837”, there is an Andrew COWAN listed for Lot # 1017 for the year 1821 and … ,
       in the document “St. Columban Marriages 1836 > 1936” there is a June 13, 1836 marriage of a Mary PHELAN, widow of a Thomas Culletan to a Michael FARRELL.
       Then, on Apr. 20, 1840 there is a marriage of a Gregory (l) FORR*I*STER - Widower of Mary COWAN, to a Mary WHELAN (PHELAN?) - Widow of Michael FARRELL.
       Also, - in the complimentary Blanchfield document “Baptisms, Deaths & Marriages 1837 > 1900”, the listing for the same above Apr. 30, 1840 marriage indicates the name FORR*I*STER with an *e* instead of an *i* and that his wife’s name is “strictly” Mary WHELAN, with no further indication as to the possibility that her surname might have in fact been PHELAN.

      Questions ???
       
       Is there a possible connection between Andrew COWAN and Mary COWAN?  Could he have been her first husband?, a brother?, or cousin maybe?
       If the marriage of Gregory FORR*I*STER to Mary COWAN is not listed in the St. Scholastique Parish records for 1825 > 1837, does anyone have any suggestion(s) as to where to look for this marriage?
       Is the Mary PHELAN married to Michael FARRELL on June 13, 1836 the same person listed as Mary WHELAN, widow of Michael Farrell, who married Gregory (l) Forr*i*ster on Apr. 30, 1840? - i.e. - did she, or did she not, change her name from PHELAN to WHELAN between her 2nd and 3rd marriages?, or, are the two couples mentioned above - i.e. - Mary WHALEN & Michael FARRELL “and” Mary PHALEN & Michael FARRELL actually two separate and distinct couples?
       Why would the document “St. Columban Marriages 1836 > 1936” list the FORR*I*STER / W? (P?)HELAN marriage as Apr. “30”, 1840, while the Blanchfield “Baptisms, Deaths & Marriages 1837 > 1900” listing indicate it as being Apr. “20”, 1840? How do I qualify which date is correct?
       In the above, if one list indicates marriages from “1836 > 1936” and the other from “1837 > 1900”, were both of these lists transcribed from the same document(s)?
       If the above two documents have in fact been transcribed from two different documents, what is the actual name(s) of, and origin of, both these documents.

                And that's only the beginning of my troubles.

Murray Quinn
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marylund

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Re: General all round confusion
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2009, 01:24:03 PM »

I'm not an expert but as I understand it: St. Columban's church records begin in 1837 because the 1836 ones were destroyed by fire. (Does anyone know if Quebec Archdiocese has a copy?) The marriages were published later in a repertoire, but not the baptisms apparently. I'm looking for my ggfather James Walsh's in Nov. 1836.

The Ste. Scholastique church records prior to 1836 are a nightmare to plow through but LDS has them on film! You must return to the primary sources.

The Phelan/Whelan name is apparently interchangeable although it would be expected to be consistent within a family.  

Perhaps Michael Farrell was a common name. I have him married in January 1835 in Ste. Scholastique to Bridget Walsh, aunt of the aforementioned James. She died in Ste. Marthe in 1875 - yet I find him as her widower much earlier being married in Montreal! Dare we say - a bigamist?  :o

Kathy Lund
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claude bourguignon

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Re: General all round confusion
« Reply #2 on: April 28, 2009, 03:49:54 PM »

En 1903 le curé Forget a recopié  les actes de mariages, baptêmes, sépultures de  la  paroisse de Saint-Colomban pour l'année 1836. Le livre contenant les documents avait brûlé lors de l'incendie du presbytère de Saint-Colomban en janvier 1837. J'en ai une copie.

Le curé Forget a rédigé vers 1905 un document généalogique sur les familles de Saint-Colomban . Il note pour les Cowan: Cowan, Mary 1ere épouse de Gregory Forestel. Plus loin, Gregory Forestel  né en 1783  et mort le 31 octobre 1868. Sa femme est Mary Cowan Il a un fils de son premier mariage Gregory marié le 17 septembre 1861 à Bridget Phelan. De son 2e mariage avec  Mary Phelan veuve de Michael Farrell nous retrouvons les enfants suivants : Ann, John, Ann, Mary.

Note: Lorsque un enfant décède il arrive fréquemment  que le prénom est reprit pour un  enfant subséquent.  

13 juin 1836  à Saint-Colomban:

Michael Farrell , farmer of Gore, maj of Thomas and Bridget Loughlan to Mary Phelan, widow of late Thomas Colleton

15 février 1836  à Saint-Colomban

John Welsh, late James and Mary Griffin to Ellen Blanchfield, maj Richard and Ann Phelan

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Murray Quinn

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Re: General all round confusion
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2009, 12:25:21 AM »

Thank you, Kathy & Merci Claude, for your input. I will try and pose fewer and simpler quetsions next time - I think. You're both very patient people. Et Claude, - j'm'excuse, mais mon franc[ch261]is irlandais (bien fracturé) n'est pas exactement assez bon pour ecrire un lettre plein'd'sens. Tabarouette!!! :o - just c[ch261] sa prends 15 minutes, et je suis totalement débiliter.
Murray Q.    
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marylund

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Re: General all round confusion
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2009, 09:29:56 AM »

Claude,

My 3rd great-grandfather James Welsh was not deceased on 15 fevrier 1836 when his son John married. James died on 15 fevrier 1859 and was buried 16 fevrier in Ste. Marthe's cemetery.

There must have been a mistake in transcription.

Kathy Lund

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